Eurostar is not a participant of the AJC:
https://www.sbb.ch/content/dam/internet/sbb/downloads/en/support/erstattungen/AJC.pdf.sbbdownload.pdf
But Eurostar is member of the Railteam who offers HOTNAT (Hop on the next available train):
https://www.railteam.eu/en/services-on-your-journey/hop-on-the-next-available-train-hotnat
Thanks for that. I will check out Lille. Connections are not as frequent, but I agree, overall it will be faster and likely smoother!
Not sure why though a missed connection would not be covered if it happened. The EU directive suggest any through ticket (eurail?) must be covered.
I'm not an expert on this but:
When there's a mandatory reservation involved Interrail doesn't count as a through ticket. Then it's up to railway companies agreements (AJC) to help you or not. They're not legally required to do anything.
For example 2 high-speed trains (say TGV followed by Eurostar) would be covered by the Agreement on Journey Continuation (AJC) but not TER + Eurostar.
Fortunately Eurostar has some of the most helpful staff out there.
Obviously companies lobbied hard to reduce the European law power...
Hello @justin1123
You could also exchange your reservation before the , but you must pay a fee (usually 20 €). I suggest to install the Eurostar app and load your reservations to manage them on your smartphone.
You're not covered by AJC or similar agreements. However Eurostar staff is generally helpful and let you board the next train after a little talk.
Honestly it's probably faster to travel via Lille. You also avoid rush hour into Paris. The security/check-in experience is also less stressful there. :)
If you really mean early morning something like:
- TER Amiens - Lille-Flandres 05:50 - 07:07
- have breakfast, walk a little
- Eurostar Lille-Europe - London St. Pancras 08:35 - 08:57
Thanks for that. I will check out Lille. Connections are not as frequent, but I agree, overall it will be faster and likely smoother!
Not sure why though a missed connection would not be covered if it happened. The EU directive suggest any through ticket (eurail?) must be covered.
Hello @justin1123
You could also exchange your reservation before the departure, but you must pay a fee (usually 20 €). I suggest to install the Eurostar app and load your reservations to manage them on your smartphone.
You're not covered by AJC or similar agreements. However Eurostar staff is generally helpful and let you board the next train after a little talk.
Honestly it's probably faster to travel via Lille. You also avoid rush hour into Paris. The security/check-in experience is also less stressful there. :)
If you really mean early morning something like:
- TER Amiens - Lille-Flandres 05:50 - 07:07
- have breakfast, walk a little
- Eurostar Lille-Europe - London St. Pancras 08:35 - 08:57
Similar related question re Eurostar connections.
I am travelling early morning from Amiens to Paris and on to London.
If I plan to take a TER train from Amiens to Paris with a 68 minute connection am I covered if this train is delayed or cancelled? The next train after this will miss my booked Eurostar.
It seems this should be covered but appreciate a check on this re both the ter train and the connection time.
Hi All, I finally got back, and have never been more glad to be home, only 2.5 days late and more than £500 out of pocket. SNCF were worse than useless and Eurostar little better, each shifting the responsibility of looking after the customer onto someone else...now I'll see if I can get any refunds.
Let us know how you get on. Keep in kind that SNCF doesn't have the last word. The French ombudsman is often a useful mediator and there's also an enforcement body for for Regulation 1371/2007 but I'm not sure if the French one is any good.
Hi All, I finally got back, and have never been more glad to be home, only 2.5 days late and more than £500 out of pocket. SNCF were worse than useless and Eurostar little better, each shifting the responsibility of looking after the customer onto someone else...now I'll see if I can get any refunds.
Fingers crossed too !
Again I'm desesperated by SNCF. As soon as something goes wrong, they make it like it's not their fault !!! Yeah of course…
His reaction to the regulations even better shows that they know what they are doing
Thanks all. Well, the latest is that I got to Montparnasse, having come from SNCF at gare du Nord where I left all my luggage. Thank goodness and I'm glad I did as the manager at Montparnasse was so rude, unhelpful and refused to honour the supposed hotel that is been told has been booked. He shouted at me and spoke over me in aggressively in French (my French is ok but he spoke loudly and very fast and I didn't understand everything). I asked him to repeat his points so I could understand, and he then said that he was ending all conversation with me, that I'd had a hotel last night and it was gare du Nord's responsibility to look after me. And with that he walked off. By then I realised there was no point wasting yet more time and energy. So, I headed back to gare du Nord, by which time the SNCF office was closed. I think they sent me there deliberately to get me off their case and pass the buck. I took my stuff and booked into the same hotel I was in last night.
What a day, and I'm still stranded in Paris with my dog.l, having left Spain on Friday lunchtime. I hope I don't meet any of the idiots tomorrow that I had to deal with today. They were all completely useless and worse, just plain rude and nasty. Fingers crossed I manage to get home tomorrow.. Thanks for the legislation links everyone, I mentioned these to the rude SNCF manager at Montparnasse and it caused him to explode, loudly in French...
The fact that theEU has repeatedly blocked attempts to give rail the same protection as air passengers suggests that the so called legislation is nothing more than guidelines.
EU Regulation 1371/2007 for rail passengers is weaker in some points than EU Regulation 261/2004 for air passengers, but it doesn't mean at all that it's just guidelines.
It's in fact the big national rail companies who block better legislation, by fiercely lobbying their governments, the European Commission and the European Parliament.
It took me 5 minutes to get this link which gives the full EU legislation, which was in place before Brexit so is currently incorporated into UK legislation.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex%3A32007R1371
If, like me, that is a bit overwhelming here is the summary with option buttons for particular scenarios.
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/passenger-rights/rail/index_en.htm
There is an option for countries to give exceptions to some operators to some of the requirements, but I believe the vast majority of operator, inside or outside the pass network, are bound by these rules. Companies cannot opt out without government permission.
Correct. It's the governments who decide on any exemptions and they can't exempt companies, but only types of traffic, which would then apply across companies.
As a summary: my understanding is that with an Interrail, you have an international through ticket to anywhere, with which you just need to have reservations where needed.
While it is possible to exempt some services from some of the requirements, national long distance services in France are not (see this table), so the cancelled night train was fully covered and SNCF are obliged to organise assistance. This does include transport by taxi to any hotel they organise, see article 18 of Regulation 1371/2007.
Thanks thibcabe, much appreciated. It says at the top, in this forum that this case is 'solved', I wonder why...I will keep all receipts and claim and thanks to everyone who has posted with links to consumer rights!
This is awful. It should be better handled. And yes French bureaucracy is horrible. Why wasn't the manager helpful... ?
I very much hope that you will be able to travel tomorrow…
Keep receipts of everything and SNCF needs to refund you. There is European legislation I know but @rvdborgt could better help you
Hi all, so thanks for your thoughts. An update - this morning, I presented myself at Eurostar with my dog and baggage, and they checked my docs to go on the next train, as they had room. Then the Eurostar woman comes back and says, sorry, your dog's tapeworm treatment is 1 hour out of date, ie, the vet on Spain gave it to him and stamped his passport on Tuesday, it's now Sunday. Border control says that dogs have to get tapeworm treatment no more than 5 days and no less than 24 hours in advance of travel. I kid you not, she wouldn't let me on the train and said "you should have thought of that before you travelled". I was stunned, not especially at her acting to the letter of the law, (though surely, 1 hour too late for a tapeworm tablet??) to the actual minute (anyone get stranded by PCR tests?), but at her attitude. She seemed unconcerned, even irritated at me and there was I stranded, with a dog, in Paris, nowhere to stay, no way of getting home. That, I found appalling. I asked to speak to her manager, and with some effort, got through to her. She was apologetic and said if there was anything she could do to change it, she would. She then asked the woman I'd spoken to, to go to SNCF, explain the situation and try to organise me a hotel. I sat on the phone trying a list of emergency vets on Paris trying to find one open who would give my dog a tapworm tablet and stamp. After 1.5 hours on the phone, I found one. It will cost me €130, then I need to wait 24 hours before I can travel. SNCF said that they will find me a hotel but I have to go back to Montparnasse from gare do Nord to arrange this in person, to then come back to gare du Nord, as apparently they can't do this kind of thing over the phone, in the 21st century. I find this hard to believe, and am standing here with dog and luggage at SNCf gare du nord. Now I'm being told to wait to talk to a manager at Eurostar who 'might be able to arrange something'. I've now been at gare du Nord for 4 hours.
.....update. a manager from Eurostar, looking not long out of school, named Sarah appeared and firstly informed me that she did not like dogs. She then informed me that I had been very lucky that they had organised a hotel for me at Montparnasse. So having come from Montparnasse last night, with heavy luggage, and dog, they want me to go back to Montparnasse stay the night and return to gare du Nord, and be grateful for it. I also at this stage have to get to the vet because the dog has to take the new tapeworm tablet to update the old one which, the validity of which, on his passport had expired by one hour. I then have to wait 24 hours after the vet stamps the pet passport before I can travel. It is almost funny how unhelpful and rude the staff are. The ones that have any power anyway. At this point, looking at the baby-faced Eurostar manager Sarah, telling me to go back to Montparnasse to stay in the hotel, via the vet (opposite direction on other side of Paris), wait 24 hours then come back to gare du Nord, and no they won't cover a taxi and they really are doing me a favour...I kind of lost it…
I then put my luggage in left luggage (€9.50 per 24 hours), and head to vet. Vet is very nice, gives dog pill, stamps passport, relieves me of €140 (tablet plus dog food as I'm out of dog food having left Spain on Friday and expecting to be home by lunchtime yesterday).
I'm now on my way to Montparnasse with the dog to talk to SNCF about a hotel....I'll update you. I feel like I'm experiencing french bureaucracy at its finest.. plus just really, really unhelpful, untrained staff. Not people you want to be relying on when travelling home from Spain, via France on trains, with luggage and an assistance dog, oh and a job, which I've had to cancel tomorrow as I'll still be stuck in Paris at 9am tomorrow morning.
Thanks everyone.
Do not get confused by guidelines, directives and regulations.
It took me 5 minutes to get this link which gives the full EU legislation, which was in place before Brexit so is currently incorporated into UK legislation.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex%3A32007R1371
If, like me, that is a bit overwhelming here is the summary with option buttons for particular scenarios.
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/passenger-rights/rail/index_en.htm
There is an option for countries to give exceptions to some operators to some of the requirements, but I believe the vast majority of operator, inside or outside the pass network, are bound by these rules. Companies cannot opt out without government permission.
It is this legislation I would like see! The fact that theEU has repeatedly blocked attempts to give rail the same protection as air passengers suggests that the so called legislation is nothing more than guidelines.
we can hardly give up rights that do not exist!
Obviously I am delighted that SNCF did look after the stranded passenger but even they can see a PR disaster in the making.
Hi Angelo. There is indeed no difference between an Interrail and an ordinary ticket. My point is neither of them offer the protection you think they have. If I buy a ticket from La Tour de carol to London I get two separate single tickets. Both have different Terms and Conditions. If my train to Paris is delayed there is no legal obligation to let me board a later Eurostar. Custom and practice means I will be able to board but it is not a defined right. In the days of the Thello services Eurostar made you buy new tickets.
I think the whole community would benefit from you or others publishing the exact documents relating to the obligations of train companies for both National and International travellers when trains are delayed.
These problems were foresee in the UK in respect of Eurostar. You can buy a ticket to London CIV in conjunction with your Eurostar ticket. If your train is delayed you can get the next Eurostar.
In my view train travellers and particularly international ones must have the same protection as air passengers. The EU has consistently blocked this going forward
I find your arguments confusing.
You seem to be saying SNCF has no liability if their late arrival or cancellation causes you to miss a train operated by another operator.
I am sure I have read that there is in fact Europe wide legislation that they are obliged to offer and pay for alternative solutions, ranging from arranging changes to taxis, reservation, changes and if no realistic onward solution then overnight accommodation. The only criteria is that the intended connection was reasonable - and again I believe that is simply that the operators planner deemed it so at time of booking.
I understand that many operators often work between themselves in an apparently informal manner (e.g. DBahn and Eurostar in Brussels), but as the OP has now updated that SNCF has given a hotel and onward voucher with Eurostar (i.e. formal arrangement). She has not had to rely on any gentleman’s agreement or pleading with Eurostar.
I may be wrong and I am sure you have a greater knowledge than I have on European Transport Legislation. rvdborgt regularly posts advice on this quoting EC directives.
I agree that there can be a million Km between the rules and the actual implementation, and even at corporate level there may be an aggressive reluctance to freely offer their obligations, but it doesn’t help to suggest we give up on our rights to help at times of need.
Hi Angelo. There is indeed no difference between an Interrail and an ordinary ticket. My point is neither of them offer the protection you think they have. If I buy a ticket from La Tour de carol to London I get two separate single tickets. Both have different Terms and Conditions. If my train to Paris is delayed there is no legal obligation to let me board a later Eurostar. Custom and practice means I will be able to board but it is not a defined right. In the days of the Thello services Eurostar made you buy new tickets.
I think the whole community would benefit from you or others publishing the exact documents relating to the obligations of train companies for both National and International travellers when trains are delayed.
These problems were foresee in the UK in respect of Eurostar. You can buy a ticket to London CIV in conjunction with your Eurostar ticket. If your train is delayed you can get the next Eurostar.
In my view train travellers and particularly international ones must have the same protection as air passengers. The EU has consistently blocked this going forward
Having “Rights” and having a way of enforcing them are two very different things.
The sending the passenger back to Spain was a classic move from someone who knew exactly what they were doing. Getting rid of a problem for someone, anyone, else to deal with, or not. It was away from them so they no longer had to do anything, job done. Added bonus with it being in a different country and train company. They should be getting their medal from SNCF headquarters any day now.
As if they weren’t bad enough anyway, some SNCF staff are extra-bolshie when disruption is due to their mouvements sociaux.
Thanks so much everyone. So, I arrived in Paris and waited for around an hour at SNCf HQ at Montparnasse, with lots of other people who has missed trains. I gave them my SNCf my booking ref and they have booked me a hotel near gare du Nord for the night, and also have me an onwards pass to present at Eurostar in the morning. So, fingers crossed I will get a train to London tomorrow morning. Re. paying for the hotel at latour de carol last night, taxi fares etc, I'll let you know how I let on claiming compensation for that. They also gave everyone a 'lunchbox' at Montparnasse, including water, a salad, pretzels, a crunchy bar and juice. Something to stave off hunger but I'll still need a meal tonight, so who knows if I'll be able to claim for that. I'll try. Will let you all know how I get on. Thank you so much everyone for the support and advice X
On a more general theme SNCF will hide behind regulations pertaining to CIV regulations when you could buy tickets across borders. If you had one of these you were protected for your journey. In general these have not existed for many years. The EU has vigorously resisted giving rail the same protection enjoyed by air travellers.
Sadly I don’t share Angelo’s viewpoint about SNCF’s responsibility to assist you for your whole journey. Legally you didn’t have a ticket from them for the journey to Paris. They would claim you are only entitled to a refund of your reservation fee to Paris. I would be the first to say this is immoral but legality and morality are not the same thing!
I would love to know what other community members think and more especially your experience of claiming compensation from SNCF when travelling with an Interail. It may be an idea to start a new conversation if enough people are interested.
I find your argument about SNCF not being liable worrying. Your Interrail pass is indeed a valid ticket for any train you travel on operated by a participating company. You should therefore have exactly the same rights as any other passenger, which have been quoted on the community many times.
On a more general theme SNCF will hide behind regulations pertaining to CIV regulations when you could buy tickets across borders. If you had one of these you were protected for your journey. In general these have not existed for many years. The EU has vigorously resisted giving rail the same protection enjoyed by air travellers.
Sadly I don’t share Angelo’s viewpoint about SNCF’s responsibility to assist you for your whole journey. Legally you didn’t have a ticket from them for the journey to Paris. They would claim you are only entitled to a refund of your reservation fee to Paris. I would be the first to say this is immoral but legality and morality are not the same thing!
I would love to know what other community members think and more especially your experience of claiming compensation from SNCF when travelling with an Interail. It may be an idea to start a new conversation if enough people are interested.